What's your "UN-holy Grail" Game(s)?

[Genghis-Pawn]

Thought this might be a fun topic and a way of exploring “Styles” of approaching the hobby. You might also call it “guilty pleasures” or think of it as a game you would only recommend very selectively. I’ll frame it in 3 questions but feel free to reply however you want:

Q1. What’s a game that you find yourself driven to get/own/keep/play even though it is not widely regarded as a great game?
(or: even though you yourself don’t think it’s a great game)

Q2: What is attractive to you about the game?
(I think the discussion may be more interesting if we avoid titles that are only attractive purely for “completionist”-collector reasons, but you do you.)

Q3: What is unattractive to you about the game?
(I think the discussion may be more interesting if this is some element of gameplay rather than ‘the art/theme isn’t my favorite’, but you do you.)

---

I don’t feel like I’ve been interested in the hobby long enough to have solid examples that are truly “grail”-like in being rare or hard to acquire. I did get fascinated with the idea of DeathMaze for a while and wound up making a PNP of it. I was attracted to it as a sort of time-capsule of that era’s game design and production standards – and it turned out that was also what I found somewhat unattractive when I sat down to actually play it. I wasn’t ready to do much roleplaying on my own to fill out the somewhat skeletal gameplay.

Two other things in my (smallish) collection that stand out are First Martians and One Deck Galaxy – both of which I sought out precisely because I had heard that the rulebooks were a mess, and yet I had it in my head that the designers must have had a solid core design buried in there somewhere, or else there’s no way the games would exist. I am attracted to the challenge of learning somewhat “inscrutable” games.

[Dungeondive]

Great topic! Might have to steal it and some of the answers for a video!

[Dungeondive]

Q1. What’s a game that you find yourself driven to get/own/keep/play even though it is not widely regarded as a great game?

My go-to answer for this is always Talisman 2nd Edition. Roll to move. Too long. Few choices. Luck dependent. Things that a lot of modern games have addressed.

Q2: What is attractive to you you about the game?
The art and feel - it scratches a rudimentary itch for an RPG-like experience where I can play as a unique character, going on quests, gaining loot, fighting monsters and exploring a world.

Q3: What is unattractive to you about the game?
The game length is a major issue, and one that can solved with quite a few house rules.

[Jerry.Hawthorne]

Warhammer Quest 95

Extra complexity in a game is a turn-off for me, when ultimately the goal is the have an adventure. I prefer streamlined rulesets.

WHQ 95, is about perfect. There are a few things that bother me, but for the most part, it hits the sweet spot for me. My main gripes would be as follows:

• Utter lack of representation. There are no female characters, nor characters of color. I find this cringey.
• Unbalanced characters
• The game bogs pretty terribly at higher levels.

[BrianKnouse5]

I really hope they remake this one day like they did for Hero Quest. It is mine as well but never got a chance to get it.

[Jerry.Hawthorne]

If I could only own 1 dungeon crawler, it would be WHQ 95

[Dungeondive]

Hey, welcome Jerry! I agree about WHQ. It’s kind of a mess, but a glorious one.

[BrianKnouse5]

I know we have talked about it before but Hero Quest with all of the Axian Quest card packs and user made content really make that game a beast to contend with as well. I could get lost in that system forever, especially how easy it is to play and get running.

[Jerry.Hawthorne]

Yeah, I love heroquest. I just love it, warts and all.

[Jerry.Hawthorne]

I just realized the original topic said that it has to be a game that is not widely recognized as a good game, so my WHQ answer is kind of off as it’s widely considered a good game.

[Genghis-Pawn]

@Jerry.Hawthorne

my WHQ answer is kind of off

Hey no worries at all. This is all just for fun anyway – I’m just looking to hear people’s perspectives on Pros and Cons. I was happy to see that your first post here on the site was a reply.

But if you feel bad, your self-imposed punishment should be to post another answer that you think is more on-topic :D

[MegaMinje]

This should be a bit of a weird answer, but…. First off, somebody’s “yuck” can often be another person’s “yum”. Everyone here has a love for dungeon crawls and adventures, but there’s a million other board games that pretty much just look awful as they’re not in our wheel house. You could easily flip that because the people that love those games likely have zero interest in dungeon crawlers. Then there’s games like A Touch of Evil that is highly regarded within this community, yet I couldn’t stand it. So, on to my actual answer lol…

There’s a silly game called Trial by Trolly that we occasionally play here. It’s something a kin to Cards Against Humanity (that kind of silly)…. But it’s dumb fun “occasionally” to just sit down a couple times a year for a half hour and decide if you’d rather have the trolly run over baby Hitler and some school kids, or something worse.

The answer is that I’d still take a good adventure or crawler over that 363 days out of the year, but I do adore those 2 days lol.

[BrianKnouse5]

I tend to like the hidden gems and rough around the corner games. I am the same way with video games as I prefer Euro jank rpgs and indie games. Just something about them that I find tend to have more emphasis on gameplay (board and video games) over flash.

[modius]

Conan

Q1. What’s a game that you find yourself driven to get/own/keep/play even though it is not widely regarded as a great game?

Conan the Destroyer. A pure skirmish battler where you reenact gloriously unbalanced scenarios in the Hyborian Age. It’s a mess of dice-rolling mayhem and questionable design decisions - absolutely love it.

Conan speaks to that part of me that cares less about balance and more about watching a sorcerer get brained by an enraged barbarian, “By Crom!”.

Conan

How this rates a BGG 7.5 beggars belief. So much hate

I’ve got just about everything.

I even picked up a collection of Batman: Gotham City Chronicles based on the same engine:

Batman: Gotham City Chronicles

The Batman system is more complex but I was sold on the full solo/co-op support across all scenarios. Alas, it broods unplayed on the shelf, like a sealed Bat-Gadget waiting for the right crisis… or perhaps just another rainy evening in Gotham.

Q2: What is attractive to you about the game?

A hefty dose of nostalgia. I’ve always loved the tales of Conan - a tangle of brutal, self-contained episodes stitched together by blood, steel, and the treachery of sorcerers and lizard men.

The Frazetta artwork doesn’t hurt either.

And then there’s the gem-based resource system: blow all your stamina in one reckless, glorious, Conan-esque turn. I love that it’s not trying to be balanced or fair - it’s trying to be Conan. And let’s be honest: driving your enemies before you and hearing the lamentation of their women is the point.

Q3: What is unattractive to you about the game?

Scenarios are locked to specific player counts and content. There’s a mountain of scenarios I’ve never touched simply because they don’t match the group or the box I’ve opened.

Putting together a session can be tricky and a spontaneous “drop-in” game is rarely viable. You need too much time, table space, and planning.

The game is also expensive and awkward to collect. Usable content is tied to specific scenarios and the more you own, the harder it seems to table. The irony of more content and a less accessible game.

You find yourself hunting for just the right scenario to justify using that one neglected box of pictish miscreants… Thankfully, newer scenarios lean into hero and enemy types rather than specific creatures, which helps.

The original design was one-vs-many, and I always ended up being “The Overlord.”

And then there are the many incarnations of Conan himself; more often stronger than his hapless companions. I don’t mind that; I like playing the plucky sidekick in the shadow of the Cimmerian. Conan hits harder. That’s sort of his whole thing. But it does appear to irk many players (ie. those who aren’t holding the Big Barbarian card).

The solo/coop play is also limited and sometimes confusing. Though much of this is rectified by copious amounts of community content – i really need to table the collective works of the Nemedian Chroniclers.

Downloadable scenarios

At some point, I’ll sit down with a pot of tea, a scroll-tube of printouts, and a dangerously false sense of organisation. But not today. Perhaps not tomorrow.

Soon.

Ish.

[stutzj]

Q1. What’s a game that you find yourself driven to get/own/keep/play even though it is not widely regarded as a great game?
Pathfinder Adventure Card Game. I think there is a pretty solid 50% of people who play it who dislike it however for me It’s probably my most played game over the past 10 years and I think a misunderstood game. It takes a full campaign playthrough to really appreciate what the game is about.

Q2: What is attractive to you about the game?*
(I think the discussion may be more interesting if we avoid titles that are only attractive purely for “completionist”-collector reasons, but you do you.)

Why I really like it:
Best character progression through a campaign I’ve ever experienced. It’s like taking a Level 1 D&D character to Level 20. Gains are incremental and small but are incredibly satisfying over an entire playthrough of 30 sessions. I get the same highly addictive feeling as playing Diablo.

I’ve grown to love the deconstructed RPG experience. It’s not a real time narrative experience but serves up all the ingredients that make it feel like an rpg experience (barriers, varied locations, skill checks, NPCs, specific villains etc). Story isn’t that important but it gives a full thematic experience.

But most of all, I just find it fun to play and a great way to shut off the brain and pass the time. I’m engaged enough by it to constantly be thinking about card interplay and optimizing everything. Having played for years, I can assure you that it is a deep experience that I find incredibly well designed.

Q3: What is unattractive to you about the game?
(I think the discussion may be more interesting if this is some element of gameplay rather than ‘the art/theme isn’t my favorite’, but you do you.)

The bloat. The system also evolved over time. I think Rise of the Runelords is a solid version but by the time of Mummy’s Mask and the 2nd Edition the system really started show what it could do with scenario design and improvements in rules.

[Genghis-Pawn]

I’m lovin’ the necro on this thread, y’all.

[Seekhashem]

Great questions and interesting responses!

HeroQuest, Warhammer Quest, and Talisman are my all time favorite games, so I cannot imagine ANYONE considering them a “yuck” (though I know some folks do). They are the definition of “yum” in my book.

They may be “of a certain age” and modern games may have a different sensibility to them, but these classics are defining games that brought many people to the hobby. Roll to move, randomness and other such mechanics are not a turn off for me. I’ll admit, taste is subjective, but these games were “great” in their time and just because the hobby and gamers’ expectations have evolved, it doesn’t change that.

I love classic games, while still enjoying many newer games. There’s a certain modern “chasing the new” and a certain attitude (found frequently on BGG) that is dismissive and unappreciative of these classic games that I will never understand.

[GWRaoul]

Q1. What’s a game that you find yourself driven to get/own/keep/play even though it is not widely regarded as a great game?
I really like the game Between Light & Shadow: Chapter 1 – Dawn and I’m already looking forward to chapter 2, which is due to be published this fall.

Q2: What is attractive to you about the game?
I find it amazing how much story is packed in this little game. It’s a kind of adventure roll & write game over 4 chapters. But you don’t play the same character in the 4 chapters, you play the story of 4 different characters in 4 time periods and every decision changes the following chapters. For example, if you don’t save a village in chapter 1, it is wiped out for the rest of the game.
And it has a very cool learn while you play system.

Q3: What is unattractive to you about the game?
The game is very difficult in some places and has a lot of dice manipulation. As a result, you can’t play much by intuition and have to think a lot. So I can’t play the game after a hard day’s work, I really have to be in the mood.

[Corgibuttz]

Q1. What’s a game that you find yourself driven to get/own/keep/play even though it is not widely regarded as a great game?
Star Trek: The Next Generation - The VCR Board Game. It’s honestly… pretty bad. But I can’t help but love to play it once a year.

Q2: What is attractive to you about the game?
I love the goofiness of it. The interaction w/ the VCR tape. The expectation that you’re supposed to respond “YES CAPTAIN KOVAK!” every time the Kiligon who stole the ship address’ you.

Q3: What is unattractive to you about the game?
I mean lets be real, the game play sucks hahaha. Still, I’ve convinced a few friends that will humor me once a year with a play through of it. Even my wife lets me torture her with it. What a lady.

[GWRaoul]

@Corgibuttz : very cool. I never owned the Star Trek version, but I still own Atmosfear 1-4 (aka Nightmare 1-4). These games are sooo stupid and we had so much fun back in the days.
I really have to check, if I find these VC Tapes on YouTube or so in German language. This is something I will play with my kids, if they are a little bit older.